Hyrum was one of the cast of characters. When warned of possible danger, Joseph urged Smith and his family to flee to Cincinnati, Ohio. I have lots of sympathy for the moral difficulties involved in keeping ones integrity through these brutal election processes. Reading his process back to church membership filled me with empathy and admiration, knowing how difficult and humbling it must have been. He graduated from Brigham Young University in 1971, with a degree in business management. Smith believed it was possible to be too rich. Among the company's other products, Smith created the Franklin Planner and seminars on productivity development based on "principles" and other concepts. Angie C. aka Hawkgrrl returns with a very a propos series of questions. And in this case, cmon! At the time of his death, Smith was an independent candidate for the Illinois state legislature.[8]. For Mormons, the repentance process is very rigorous for adulterers. I do believe the recent one was, but I admit I havent seen any source documents myself clarifying that. John Taylor survived the severe wounds he received at Carthage and went on to become the third president of the LDS Church. This council was formed by Joseph Smith in March 1844 and was continued by Brigham Young. Nonetheless, I stand by my statement that Mormons have a big problem with adultery, and I do think we are dismissive of what we consider incomplete repentance, including other faiths repentance steps. So the Church does NOTHING, the wife keeps her mouth shut, because why bother telling anyone in leadership about it? BYU's L. Tom Perry Special Collections houses one of the finest collections of documents and manuscripts related to the early history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day . Hyrum W. Smith Contact Privacy Policy Spocket Reviews In the world of e-commerce, finding reliable and efficient suppliers can be a challenge. You have been permanently banned from this board. How can an adulterer be called of God? Great talk that explores suicide, excommunication, forgiveness, and the love of the Savior By Hyrum Smith (the Franklin Covey one) Close. Judging by the negativity of your post, I think its clear what kind of campaign youd run if you had $20million to spend to get yourself elected as the judgingist negativity detecting commenter evar. In 1838, the church was renamed the "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints". On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. The difference seems to be one of humility and repentance. "Many 'crazies' have come and gone and the Church has kept silent on them," Hyrum Smith noted in an e-mail. One of our most oft quoted scriptures states: D&C 82: 3 For of him unto whom much is given much is required; and he who sins against the greater light shall receive the greater condemnation. They really believe that what they believe is really real and that is Jesus is real. Hyrum Smith Born: 9 February 1800, Tunbridge, Vermont Assistant counselor in the First Presidency: 3 September 1837 (age 37) Second counselor to President Joseph Smith: 7 November 1837 Patriarch to the Church and Assistant President of the Church: 24 January 1841 Died: 27 June 1844 (age 44), Carthage, Illinois Then he is an immoral loud-mouthed egotist on top of that. All rights reserved. Hyrum Wayne Smith 1943 - 2019 . I think Mormons strive to raise the bar, which leads to expecting more of leaders, less tolerance for sin, and then when there is humility and contrition, more tolerance to forgive and sympathize similar to your reaction of Hyrum Smiths story. Those of us who remember the 90s feel betrayed by him. I was alive and well during the 90s and apparently some people have incredibly short memories, or are desperate or both. I also wanted to say Im with still confused on comment #1- in that my personal distaste for Newt Gingrich is unrelated to his extramarital affairs. It is hard that more than a few religious people find a serial adulterer of ill wives, more normal and acceptable than a Mormon. My first thought was that he probably would not be LDS any more, having been excommunicated, and it is unlikely he would have undergone the rigors of the process to become rebaptized. He loved serving on the board of the U.S. Army Command and General Staff College for several years. Also, consider this: All three *witnesses* were eventually excommunicated from the Mormon church. In February 2007, Ida Smith attended a lecture about Mary Magdalene at the Salt Lake City Public Library. Its not that Im harder on sin (although I am, compared to mot evangelicals); its that Im harder on pure, unadulterated, rank, boundless hypocrisy, manipulation and ego. Authoring several religious books throughout his time, Smith is best known for the books, '10 Natural Laws of Successful Time and Life Management' and 'What Matters Most.' Hyrum was one of the original creators of the popular Franklin Day Planner. In 1997 it became the . Over time it was discovered that he was no better than Clinton with his lying (its not just the affairs themselves, but the complete hypocrisy) and then double that. Since then he has lived with his family in Honolulu, Portland Oregon, Ventura California, Simi Valley California, Centerville Utah, St. George Utah, with the last 20 years being spent at his beloved Eagle Mountain Ranch in Gunlock, Utah. He was president in the wrong time for his set of skills, IMO. There will be overflow facilities available in the adjacent ward house. Turns out he is My first thought was that he probably would not be LDS any more, having been excommunicated for condoning torture, immoral wars, warmongering, all sorts of violence, and threats of nuclear wars on imagined enemies, and it is unlikely he would have undergone the rigors of the process to become rebaptized. And hes smug. 2. He was the older brother of the movement's founder, Joseph Smith, and was killed with him in a lynching at a jail . That doesnt mean he wont be a good President. I think Newt is a convenient sideshow. As others in the comments have alluded, what bother me about Newt is his saying stuff like this: It doesnt matter what I do. They were ultimately blessed with six children and 24 grandchildren. Do I judge Newt by the same standards that I use to judge Joseph and my father? Information. He married Jerusha Barden in November 1826. Are Mormons culturally more critical of serious flaws in leaders than of others? I wouldnt vote for Romney either, but I do want people to like him. I think we are more tough on adultery, yes, and more judgmental in general. A member fellow here cheats on his wife, emotionally abuses her, molests his daughter. or at least to not like him for political reasons instead of his religion. I dont want Romney to win the general election, but I feel proud when he does well. Bear in mind that he was in year two of another six-year affair at the time. He was raised in Honolulu, Hawaii as a consequence of his family moving there. People need to hear what I have to say. CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (. WTH doesnt even begin to describe my reaction to that one. I suppose you are right from that perspective. As a Mormon, the reason Joseph Smith is so important is because how I interpret his actions sets the tone for my fundamental understanding of morality, so it ties in to how I understand and deal with my father. And in the JST version of the Bible, we re-examine this verse from Luke: Luke 12:57 But he that knew not his Lords will, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few. . He also said he saw the angel Moroni. Newt is safely other and makes a reasonable scapegoat for a members frustration with lying, cheating, and hypocrisy. Maybe so. Could be, I just don't know much bad stuff about him. As one of the Eight Witnesses, Hyrum testified of the authenticity of the Book of Mormon plates, and he later assisted in the printing of the Book of Mormon. The Smith Family would like to especially thank the many friends that came to visit, called on the phone, sent emails and cards and brought food in the last few months of Hyrums life. During his residence there, he served as foreman of the quarry providing stone for the Kirtland Temple. Perhaps its just a matter of degree. My antipathy to Newt can best be described as a mosaic of dishonesty. On 2 November 1826, in Manchester, New York, he married Jerusha Barden (18051837). Santorum would be my pick if he wasnt so far behind in both primary and national polls, therefore a vote for him is a vote for a losing strategy. Hyrum was born in Tunbridge, Vermont, the second son of Joseph Smith Sr. and Lucy Mack Smith. In 1983 he co-founded the Franklin Quest Company to produce the planner and train individuals and organizations in the time management principles on which the planner was based. When his parents lost their home in Palmyra, Hyrum took them into his homehis father and mother and five siblings, ages seven to twenty-one, and Oliver Cowdery. As a result of this decision, his wife of 32 years divorced him and he was excommunicated from the LDS Church. In your opinion, why do Mormons dislike Newt. Anecdotal evidence at best, but Newts serial infidelity does seem troubling to most Mormons I have discussed politics with. Newt is running against one of us. A forum for ex-mormons and others who have been affected by mormonism to get I would think more than twice about Newt in pretty much any election, simply because I loathe his candidacy so much. If you can be saved simply by saying God, I am a sinner then why cant you be forgiven simply by saying God, Im sorry.. He was raised in Honolulu, Hawaii as a consequence of his family moving there when he was three years old, where his father was the head of the speech department at the University of Hawaii. He attended BYU for a year followed by a semester at New York Queens College before serving two years in the British Mission, London England for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Probably it depends more on where we live too, small towns are more judgmental and know each others business. I know plenty of Mormons who liked Newt although most of them came of age after Newts meltdown in the 90s. But even if he werent Mormon hes not exactly the person who excites the base of the Republican party. -Avoids just punishments Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. This is a tension found among the Gospels, with Joseph Smith doing some harmonizing work. Welcome to the works of Dr. Hyrum L. Andrus. Maybe. Wayne Cutler Gunnell stated that on December 31, 1844, "Phineas H. Young . They had six children together. Joseph senior became the first Patriarch of the church, succeeded upon his death by his son Hyrum, assistan. He said, I just want to stay here meaning Eagle Mountain Ranch. Smith was a direct descendant of Hyrum Smith, who died in 1844 alongside his brother, Mormon founder Joseph Smith, at the hands of an angry mob at the jail in Carthage, Ill. 24 Hour Services - Have an emergency? * Inducted into the Utah Business Hall of Fame, * Utah Governor declared September 27, Tuacahn Day in honor of Hyrum, * U.S. Army Outstanding Civilian Service Medal, * Distinguished Member of the U.S. Army OCS Hall of Fame, * Member of the U.S. Army OCS Hall of Fame, * Member of the Artillery OCS Hall of Fame, * Honor Graduate of Artillery Officer Candidate School. Hyrum Smith the patriarch was never charged with or found guilty of adultery. He was quite upset by Newts behavior during his marriages. He named the system after Benjamin Franklin, the inventor and statesman, who also kept a small notebook for daily jottings and observations. Thats why I wont vote for the ego-maniacal troll. I think people who support him are projecting upon him capabilities and strengths he doesnt have. Member American Society Training and Development. One wonders when political expediency goes to situational ethics. Maybe another dimension to this: Mormon forgiveness of Mitts past liberal-ness (on abortion, gay rights). Hyrum Smith had little education and . Being forgiven of any sin simply requires asking God for forgiveness. Marcus, I do consider that too in my own evaluation. I think being on the side of all parties is right, whenever possible, since that is clearly the route God takes. Personally, if he wins I really hope moderate, pragmatic Guvn Romney shows up rather than right-wing pandering Romney. I don't have a link, but I think those come from Wm. He is very proud of the impact that the Franklin Day Planner has had on hundreds of thousands of people. He explained his abundance mentality in a 2017 interview: The minute we are able to look into the mirror and honestly say, I have sufficient for my needs, at that point, you are wealthy. Get that minor non-salvific point outta here. Funeral services will be held Tuesday, December 3, 2019 at 12:00 p.m. at the Ivins Stake Center, 260 East 1060 South, Ivins, Utah. They do. HE MARRIED Ruth Pingree, June 5, 1929, in the Salt Lake LDS Temple. Hyrum never really retired; he just changed his focus of where he was spending his time. This thought lessened my respect for him even further. Three years later, Smith wrote a book, What Matters Most, which in part discussed a period of personal crisis. Family members suggest donations be made in Smiths name to the Hyrum and Gail Smith Endowment at Tuacahn. Do these differences mean that Evangelicals are lighter on (spiritual) crime than Mormons? michael afton in real life; hunterdon central baseball schedule; drax i have famously large turds gif; serta big and tall office chair model 49734; benjamin allbright wife; carla abellana and tom rodriguez relationship; why do i get goosebumps when my boyfriend touches me; I would be VERY interested to hear from a Mormon who prefers Newt over Romney. In lieu of flowers please donate to the, Hyrum & Gail Smith Tuacahn Legacy Endowment. Newt was responsible for the brilliance of the Contract with America and nationalizing congressional races. I think the adultery issue is often mishandledI dont agree that disclosure to a husband or wife is a good idea if it was a non-emotional one-off type of affair. In tscc, when that shit happens you can rest assured that some great stuff has gone down the memory hole, and that the whitewash has been splashed about with great liberality. He loved his country and honored all men and women who served or who are serving in all branches of the U.S. military. As a teenager, he began reading books from the family library while sitting on the ditch bank waiting . After he gives his standard answer to the question, he gives the guys who asked it a reading assignment: And it came to pass, as [], Newt Gingrich: The Indispensable Republican., Mormon History Association Awards Nominations: Deadline Feb.15. I feel very judgemental criticizing another person like this, I wish not to do it, and Im sorry for throwing some of the comments back at you, but this post made me sink into despair. I will admit his adultery and its details do weight heavily in my consideration. Board member Great Salt Lake Council, Boy Scouts American, since 1982, Explorers, since 1982. He is a grandiose narcissist of the highest order. Hyrum received a limited education, and established himself as a farmer. Yes, I think we do (though we probably shouldnt even the righteous judgement clause is for those in a position to judge). Hyrum was a member of the Council of Fifty in Nauvoo, Illinois. I too remember him from the 90s during the Clinton impeachment. Hyrum has served on the board in several different capacities, including Chairman, and was fulfilling a Vice-Chairman role when he passed. From what I have consistently heard, the biggest Mormon objection to Newt is his serial adultery, especially because the wives he cheated on and eventually left were gravely ill at the time he left them for younger women. Underground polygamists 0, manifesto FTW. lose my respect the more I learn. Good post, and a lot of interesting questions. The Infinite. He served an LDS mission to Hawaii in 19[20]. Its situations like this that lead me to believe that when a crime is commited like molesting your daughter, go to the police first then the Bishop. Wifes lawyer to question woman in Gingrich divorce case. Marysville Journal-Tribune. I would mention his own getting kicked out of the chairmanship by the Republican Party, but staunch supporters say the charges were later proven false and consider it proof of a Republican elitist conspiracy. He also replaced Oliver Cowdery as Assistant President of the Church; in this capacity, Smith acted as President of the Church in Joseph's absence and was designated to be Joseph's successor if he were killed or incapacitated. Learn how and when to remove this template message, Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Acting President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, "Moroni Appeared to 17 Different People! Whos tuff on sin? Is our repentance process evidence of Mormons being more focused on works whereas to Evangelicals, grace is sufficient? See Section 132. He was a master communicator, combining wit and good storytelling to teach principles that incite lasting personal change. As to other peoples adulteries and subsequent painful scenarios what happens in the labyrinth of bad relationships is often hidden from the participants themselves, let alone outside parties. I do believe we tend to be more judgmental of marital infidelity, but my own views have softened somewhat over the years. His eldest son, John Smith, served as the church's Presiding Patriarch from 1855 to 1911. So, why dont people here want to vote for Romney? Hyrum was passionate in his effort to make a positive difference in the world. The Axiom of Regularity, Theological Tag-alongs,Mormonism. -Should be excommunicated StillConfused theres a link in the OP about the story of Hyrum Smith, founder of Franklin Planners, and his adultery & trip back to the church. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. This belief is based entirely on one small anecdote: When Joseph was asked how exactly he translated the Book of Mormon, he never gave any details, he only said that he did it by the "gift and power of God." It isnt just that he committed adultery multiple times in despicable circumstances, but add to that his ethic violations (it is rather hard to get censured by congress) and his obvious prevarication around his lobbying compounded with his clear pattern of narcissism it is amazing to me he could be voted dog catcher much less President of the US.